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    PNC
    Earnings call· Dec 2024(Q4 FY24)

    PNC FINANCIAL SERVICES GROUP, INC. PNC

    Jan 16, 2025 Source

    Executive summary

    The PNC Financial Services Group Q4 FY24 — Solid Quarter, Strong FY24, and Positive FY25 Outlook

    PNC delivered a solid fourth quarter, capping a strong 2024 with record revenue and significant capital returns. The bank enters 2025 with positive momentum, driven by fixed asset repricing tailwinds, expected NII growth, and continued expense discipline, positioning for substantial positive operating leverage. While loan demand remains soft, strategic investments in technology and branch expansion aim to accelerate organic growth and enhance customer experience.

    Highlights

    5
    • Full year 2024 net income of $6 billion or $13.74 per share.

    • Record revenue of $21.6 billion for full year 2024, with fee income growing 6%.

    • Tangible book value per share increased 12% year-over-year to $95.33.

    • Returned $3 billion of capital to shareholders in 2024 through dividends and share buybacks.

    • Estimated CET1 ratio of 10.5% and revised standardized ratio of 9.2% as of December 31.

    Concerns

    5
    • AOCI was negative $6.6 billion at quarter-end, reflecting the impact of higher rates.

    • Commercial real estate loans declined $1 billion linked quarter, with period-end commercial loans down $5 billion.

    • Total delinquencies were up $107 million or 8% linked quarter, primarily in commercial loans.

    • CRE office portfolio continues to see stress, with reserves increasing to 13% from 11% and expected additional charge-offs.

    • Mortgage revenue declined $59 million linked quarter, primarily due to elevated RMSR hedge gains in the third quarter.

    Guidance & targets

    18
    CategoryTargetConfidence
    Full-year 2025 Spot Loan Growth
    2% to 3%
    medium materiality
    High
    Full-year 2025 Average Loan Growth
    Stable
    medium materiality
    High
    Full-year 2025 Total Revenue Growth
    Up approximately 6%
    high materiality
    High
    Full-year 2025 Net Interest Income Growth
    Up 6% to 7%
    high materiality
    High
    Full-year 2025 Noninterest Income Growth
    Up approximately 5%
    medium materiality
    High
    Full-year 2025 Noninterest Expense Growth
    Up approximately 1%
    high materiality
    High
    Full-year 2025 Effective Tax Rate
    Approximately 19%
    medium materiality
    High
    Full-year 2025 Operating Leverage
    Substantial positive operating leverage
    high materiality
    High
    Q1 2025 Average Loans
    Down approximately 1%
    medium materiality
    High
    Q1 2025 Net Interest Income
    Down 2% to 3%
    high materiality
    High
    Q1 2025 Fee Income
    Stable
    medium materiality
    High
    Q1 2025 Other Noninterest Income (excluding Visa activity)
    $150 million to $200 million
    low materiality
    High
    Q1 2025 Total Revenue
    Down 1% to 2%
    high materiality
    High
    Q1 2025 Total Noninterest Expense
    Down 2% to 3%
    high materiality
    High
    Q1 2025 Net Charge-offs
    Approximately $300 million
    medium materiality
    High
    Full-year 2025 Net Interest Margin
    Approaching 3%
    high materiality
    Medium
    Full-year 2025 Deposit Growth
    1% to 2%
    medium materiality
    Medium
    Full-year 2025 Share Repurchase Pace
    $100 million to $200 million per quarter
    medium materiality
    High

    Segment performance

    1
    SegmentRevenueYoYQoQMargin
    CRE Office Portfolio
    Balances declined as the company continues to manage exposure down. Criticized loans and nonperforming balances also declined. Despite lower charge-offs in Q4, stress continues, and additional charge-offs are expected. Reserves increased due to continued valuation adjustments.
    Balances: declined approximately $500 million linked quarterNet loan charge-offs: $62 million (Q4 FY24), down from $95 million (Q3 FY24)Reserves: 13% (Q4 FY24), up from 11% (Q3 FY24)
    -7%

    Operational metrics

    24
    Core Noninterest Expense
    $152 milliondown 1%
    FY24 vs FY23

    Core noninterest expense decreased compared to the prior year.

    Noninterest Expense
    $3.5 billionup $179 million or 5% QoQ
    Q4 FY24

    The increase included $79 million of noncore items.

    Noncore Expenses
    $79 million
    Q4 FY24

    Reflected $97 million of asset impairments, partially offset by an $18 million reduction to the FDIC special assessment.

    Asset Impairments
    $97 million
    Q4 FY24

    Primarily related to various technology investments.

    FDIC Special Assessment Reduction
    $18 million
    Q4 FY24

    Offset asset impairments in noncore expenses.

    Core Noninterest Expense
    $100 millionup 3% QoQ
    Q4 FY24

    Increase largely due to seasonality and higher marketing spend.

    Continuous Improvement Program (CIP) Savings
    $450 millionexceeded goal
    FY24

    The company exceeded its 2024 goal for cost savings.

    Continuous Improvement Program (CIP) Target
    $350 million
    FY25

    This program will fund a significant portion of ongoing business and technology investments.

    Effective Tax Rate
    14.6%
    Q4 FY24

    Included income tax benefits from tax matters resolution.

    Accumulated Other Comprehensive Income (AOCI)
    -$6.6 billionvs -$5.1 billion (Q3 FY24)
    Q4 FY24

    Reflecting the impact of higher rates.

    Yield on Total Loans
    5.87%down 26 bps QoQ
    Q4 FY24

    Primarily driven by lower short-term rates.

    Yield on Securities Portfolio
    3.17%up 9 bps QoQ
    Q4 FY24

    Driven by higher rates on new purchases and runoff of lower-yielding securities.

    Rate Paid on Interest-Bearing Deposits
    2.43%down 29 bps QoQ
    Q4 FY24

    Reflecting pricing actions commensurate with Fed rate cuts.

    Cumulative Deposit Beta
    47%
    Through December

    Reflects the responsiveness of deposit rates to changes in the federal funds rate.

    Total Capital Returned to Shareholders
    $3 billion
    FY24

    Through dividends and share buybacks.

    Total Capital Returned to Shareholders
    $900 million
    Q4 FY24

    Through both common dividends and share repurchases.

    C&IB Sales in Expansion Markets
    26%
    FY24

    Reflects accelerated new client growth in expansion markets.

    Noninterest-Bearing Deposits Share
    23%stable QoQ
    Q4 FY24

    Percentage of total average deposits.

    Investment Securities Floating Rate Share
    20%vs 6% a year ago
    Q4 FY24

    Reflects strategy to reduce interest rate sensitivity.

    Available-for-Sale (AFS) Portfolio Floating Rate Share
    40%
    Q4 FY24

    Floating rate securities are a higher-yielding alternative to excess cash at the Federal Reserve.

    Duration of Securities Portfolio
    3.4 years
    Q4 FY24

    As of December 31.

    Active Receive Fixed Rate Swaps
    $37 billion
    Q4 FY24

    Pointed to the commercial loan book.

    Forward Starting Receive Fixed Rate Swaps
    $13 billion
    Q4 FY24

    Pointed to the commercial loan book.

    Weighted Average Received Rate on Active Swaps
    3.22%up 14 bps QoQ
    Q4 FY24

    Reflects changes in interest rates.

    Industry KPIs

    13
    MetricValueDetails
    Loans$319 billionUSD
    Deposits$425 billionUSD
    Rotce ROE
    Cet1 ratio10.5%%
    Capital returns$200 millionUSD
    Fee income lines$1.9 billionUSD
    Allowance reserves$5.2 billionUSD
    Net interest income$3.5 billionUSD
    Net interest margin2.75%%
    Net charge offs npls$250 millionUSD
    Total operating expenses$3.5 billionUSD
    Provision for credit losses$156 millionUSD
    Efficiency ratio operating leverage

    Deals & partnerships

    1
    TCWStrategic partnership to fund clients through alternative vehicles.

    PNC formed a partnership with TCW to provide alternative funding solutions for clients, particularly in instances where private capital might otherwise draw clients away, ensuring PNC retains the client relationship and associated fee income.

    Risks & headwinds

    3
    CRE Office Portfolio StressOngoing, future quarters

    Balances declined 7% or approximately $500 million linked quarter; reserves increased to 13% from 11%; expected additional charge-offs.

    Mitigation: Actively managing exposure down; increased reserves to 13%; believe adequately reserved.

    Market UncertaintyOngoing

    Not quantified, but cited as a factor for soft loan demand.

    Mitigation: PNC's balance sheet is well positioned; adequately reserved for credit risk; strong capital levels provide substantial flexibility.

    Regulatory EnvironmentOngoing

    Not quantified.

    Mitigation: Advocating for regulators to focus on core risks and follow the law; industry has sued on certain proposals.

    What to watch in Q1 FY25

    5

    NIM Trajectory

    FY25
    Current2.75% (Q4 FY24)
    TargetApproaching 3% by end of FY25

    Why it matters

    NIM expansion is a key driver of NII growth and overall profitability, especially with expected rate cuts.

    We do expect NIM to continue to increase through the course of 2025. We've approached that 3% level in the past, and I think it's logical to assume that we'd get close to that.

    Q&A highlights

    5

    Inquired about industry deposit trends, PNC's ability to gain retail deposit share, and the drivers/cadence of NII guidance, especially the fixed asset reprice.

    Rob Reilly expects 1-2% deposit growth for FY25, with seasonality. Confirmed fixed asset reprice is balanced and continues through 2025 and beyond. Q1 NII decline is 75% due to fewer days, balance from seasonal commercial deposits.

    Our guide for the full year and for the first quarter is very conservative in terms of loan growth. Average loans for the full year stable, spot up 2% to 3%.

    asked by John McDonald · answered by Robert Reilly

    3 min read7 chapters

    Detailed Narrative

    01

    Strategic Investments & Expansion

    PNC is actively investing in its future growth, including the rollout of a new online banking platform designed to enhance customer experience and enable rapid product innovation. The company is also doubling its new branch builds to gain scale in fast-growing regions and recently announced its entry into the Salt Lake City market. These initiatives are part of a broader strategy to accelerate organic growth and improve operational agility, with investments focused on cloud-native and micro-service based solutions.

    02

    Fixed Asset Repricing Tailwinds

    The bank anticipates significant tailwinds from fixed asset repricing over the next couple of years, which is expected to contribute to record Net Interest Income (NII) in 2025. This strategy involves reinvesting runoff from short-term duration securities and swap portfolios into higher-yielding assets. Management noted that they are using forward-starting swaps to lock in future replacement yields, effectively securing higher rates for maturing fixed-rate assets through 2025 and beyond, assuming rates follow the forward curve.

    03

    Credit Quality Management & CRE Office Portfolio

    While overall credit metrics remain sound, the Commercial Real Estate (CRE) office portfolio continues to be a focus due to ongoing stress and lack of demand for office properties. PNC is actively managing down its exposure, with balances declining 7% or approximately $500 million linked quarter. Reserves on this portfolio increased to 13% from 11% in the prior quarter, reflecting continued valuation adjustments, and the bank expects additional charge-offs, though the size will vary quarter-to-quarter. Management believes they are adequately reserved for this segment.

    04

    Deposit Growth & Funding Costs

    Average deposits increased by $3 billion or 1% linked quarter, primarily driven by continued growth in interest-bearing commercial balances. Noninterest-bearing deposits remained stable at $96 billion, representing 23% of total average deposits. The rate paid on interest-bearing deposits declined 29 basis points to 2.43% in Q4, reflecting pricing actions aligned with Fed rate cuts. The cumulative deposit beta through December was 47%, with expectations for it to remain in the high 40% range during the anticipated rate-cutting cycle.

    05

    Operating Leverage & Cost Discipline

    PNC successfully generated positive operating leverage for the full year 2024, exceeding its continuous improvement program (CIP) cost savings goal of $450 million. For 2025, the company has set an annual CIP target of $350 million, which will continue to fund a significant portion of its ongoing business and technology investments. This disciplined approach to expense management, combined with expected revenue growth, positions PNC to deliver substantial positive operating leverage in 2025.

    06

    Capital Management & Flexibility

    The bank maintains a strong capital position, with an estimated CET1 ratio of 10.5% and a revised standardized ratio (including AOCI) of 9.2% as of December 31. PNC returned $3 billion of capital to shareholders in 2024 through dividends and share buybacks, including approximately $900 million in Q4. The company plans to continue share repurchases at a pace of $100 million to $200 million per quarter in 2025, emphasizing its capital flexibility and commitment to shareholder returns.

    07

    Loan Demand & Utilization Trends

    Despite strong unfunded commitment growth, actual loan utilization remains low across commercial segments, including C&I, middle market, and specialty businesses. Management attributes this to the total cost of capital, ongoing market uncertainty🌐, and the attractiveness of capital markets for large corporates. This conservative outlook on loan growth (stable average full-year loans for 2025) is a key assumption in the bank's guidance, as management has opted not to forecast an inflection point for increased utilization.

    AI-generated summary of the company’s earnings call. Not investment advice.